Episode 178

Disciple Up # 178
Stupid Things Christians Say Part 5: It’s Not the Same Anymore
By Louie Marsh, 9-23-2020

 Intro – a little bit of a ramble today most likely, so hang on!

nos·tal·gia

noun

  1. a sentimental longing or wistful affection for the past, typically for a period or place with happy personal associations.

ORIGIN OF NOSTALGIA

1770–80; <New Latin <Greek nóst(os) a return home + -algia-algia

Nostalgia In the Bible:

10  Say not, “Why were the former days better than these?” For it is not from wisdom that you ask this. Ecclesiastes 7:10 (ESV)

2  “Oh, that I were as in the months of old, as in the days when God watched over me, Job 29:2 (ESV)

1  By the waters of Babylon, there we sat down and wept, when we remembered Zion. Psalm 137:1 (ESV)

17  We’re going to go right on offering sacrifices to the Queen of Heaven and pouring out drink offerings to her, keeping up the traditions set by our ancestors, our kings and government leaders in the cities of Judah and the streets of Jerusalem in the good old days. We had a good life then—lots of food, rising standard of living, and no bad luck. Jeremiah 44:17 (MSG)

LINKS:

https://www.frontiersin.org/research-topics/11716/current-issues-in-nostalgia-research

https://www.gotquestions.org/nostalgic-nostalgia.html

https://chadashby.com/2017/05/31/biblical-nostalgia-in-a-postmodern-world/

15  And the men who have been mentioned by name rose and took the captives, and with the spoil they clothed all who were naked among them. They clothed them, gave them sandals, provided them with food and drink, and anointed them, and carrying all the feeble among them on donkeys, they brought them to their kinsfolk at Jericho, the city of palm trees. Then they returned to Samaria. 2 Chronicles 28:15 (ESV)

29  But he, desiring to justify himself, said to Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?” 30  Jesus replied, “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and he fell among robbers, who stripped him and beat him and departed, leaving him half dead. 31  Now by chance a priest was going down that road, and when he saw him he passed by on the other side. 32  So likewise a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33  But a Samaritan, as he journeyed, came to where he was, and when he saw him, he had compassion. 34  He went to him and bound up his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he set him on his own animal and brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35  And the next day he took out two denarii and gave them to the innkeeper, saying, ‘Take care of him, and whatever more you spend, I will repay you when I come back.’ 36  Which of these three, do you think, proved to be a neighbor to the man who fell among the robbers?” 37  He said, “The one who showed him mercy.” And Jesus said to him, “You go, and do likewise.” Luke 10:29-37 (ESV)

My Camino Video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqPfqYessTc&t=1660s

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Episode 173

173 Disciple Up Show Notes
Stupid Things Christians Say, Pt. 3
By Louie Marsh, 8-19-2020

Intro. Book – only had one suggestion – Hebrews, will probably go with it.

STUPID THINGS CHRISTIANS SAY:

1) Your [child, loved one] died because God needed another Angel, or a choir member or… 

 

There’s also a softer version of this saying that goes something like this: “God gained another angel today.”

 

While the latter is slighter better than the former both are horrible and both are wrong from a Biblical point of view.

 

  • Here is the plain and simple truth. Humans are humans, and angels are angels. This does not and cannot change.

 

In fact, angels are intrigued by the interaction between God and His “image-bearing” humans: “It was revealed to them that they were serving not themselves but you, in the things that have now been announced to you through those who preached the good news to you by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven, things into which angels long to look (1 Peter 1:12).”

 

It’s actually better for you to be human than it is for you to be an angel. Ezekiel 28:12 – 18, Isaiah 14:12 – 14, and Revelation 12:4 describe the fall of Lucifer (a former angel) and one-third of the angels (now considered demons) that joined his revolt against holy God.

 

What arrests your attention in these accounts is that the judgment of the angels was final, with no hope of redemption. I believe this is what the 1 Peter passage is discussing, when he says, “things which angels long to look.” They are astonished by God’s love for you and I.

 

“But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us (Romans 5:8).”

 

Christ died for people, not angels! And in fact we’re going to judge the Angels. 2  Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if the world is to be judged by you, are you incompetent to try trivial cases? 3  Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life! 1 Corinthians 6:2-3 (ESV)

 

  • No where in Scripture is God said to decide when everyone died. He did NOT kill your child.

 

When a loved one dies knowing Jesus, God does not gain another angel, but a child comes home.

 

  • God doesn’t NEED ANYTHING! If He did He wouldn’t be God.

 

22  So Paul, standing in the midst of the Areopagus, said: “Men of Athens, I perceive that in every way you are very religious. 23  For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, ‘To the unknown god.’ What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you. 24  The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, 25  nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything. 26  And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place, 27  that they should seek God, and perhaps feel their way toward him and find him. Yet he is actually not far from each one of us, Acts 17:22-27 (ESV)

 

2) How many people have you saved (or healed)? 

 

6  But Peter said, “I have no silver and gold, but what I do have I give to you. In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, rise up and walk!” 7  And he took him by the right hand and raised him up, and immediately his feet and ankles were made strong. 8  And leaping up he stood and began to walk, and entered the temple with them, walking and leaping and praising God. 9  And all the people saw him walking and praising God, 10  and recognized him as the one who sat at the Beautiful Gate of the temple, asking for alms. And they were filled with wonder and amazement at what had happened to him. Acts 3:6-10 (ESV)

 

8  Now at Lystra there was a man sitting who could not use his feet. He was crippled from birth and had never walked. 9  He listened to Paul speaking. And Paul, looking intently at him and seeing that he had faith to be made well, 10  said in a loud voice, “Stand upright on your feet.” And he sprang up and began walking. 11  And when the crowds saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in Lycaonian, “The gods have come down to us in the likeness of men!” 12  Barnabas they called Zeus, and Paul, Hermes, because he was the chief speaker. 13  And the priest of Zeus, whose temple was at the entrance to the city, brought oxen and garlands to the gates and wanted to offer sacrifice with the crowds. 14  But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of it, they tore their garments and rushed out into the crowd, crying out, 15  “Men, why are you doing these things? We also are men, of like nature with you, and we bring you good news, that you should turn from these vain things to a living God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. 16  In past generations he allowed all the nations to walk in their own ways. 17  Yet he did not leave himself without witness, for he did good by giving you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying your hearts with food and gladness.” 18  Even with these words they scarcely restrained the people from offering sacrifice to them. Acts 14:8-18 (ESV)

 

3) “God showed up!” Isn’t He always with us?  

 

I know what people mean when they say this. It’s mainly an inartful way of expressing that God really moved in a particular situation. So, without becoming a nitpicker, there are a couple of things about this saying that really bother me.

 

  • First of all – God is Always with us!

 

14  The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. 2 Corinthians 13:14 (ESV)

 

18  And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19  Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20  teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Matthew 28:18-20 (ESV)

 

  • Secondly – it implies that when there’s no flashy miracle, etc. God isn’t there, and that’s totally unscriptural and a BAD belief to be spreading where you mean too or not.

 

8  For we do not want you to be unaware, brothers, of the affliction we experienced in Asia. For we were so utterly burdened beyond our strength that we despaired of life itself. 9  Indeed, we felt that we had received the sentence of death. But that was to make us rely not on ourselves but on God who raises the dead. 10  He delivered us from such a deadly peril, and he will deliver us. On him we have set our hope that he will deliver us again. 2 Corinthians 1:8-10 (ESV)

 

7  So to keep me from becoming conceited because of the surpassing greatness of the revelations, a thorn was given me in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to harass me, to keep me from becoming conceited. 8  Three times I pleaded with the Lord about this, that it should leave me. 9  But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10  For the sake of Christ, then, I am content with weaknesses, insults, hardships, persecutions, and calamities. For when I am weak, then I am strong. 2 Corinthians 12:7-10 (ESV)

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Disciple Up # 171
Stupid Things Christian’s Say, Pt 2
“Everything Happens for A Reason”
By Louie Marsh, 7-5-2020

Links to Sites Quoted From on this podcast:

 https://www.inc.com/thomas-koulopoulos/its-time-to-say-it-everything-does-not-happen-for-a-reason.html

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/finding-purpose/201807/why-we-think-everything-happens-reason

https://ideapod.com/everything-happens-for-a-reason-7-reasons-to-believe-in-this-philosophy/

https://www.christianity.com/wiki/christian-life/does-everything-really-happen-for-a-reason.html

Does everything happen for a reason? Yes.

Scientifically everything has a cause and then has an effect. That effect then often causes other things to happen. So yes, in the physical world everything is caused by something else. Nothing just spontaneously occurs for no reason whatsoever.  So, in the physical world nothing happens without a cause, or a reason for it happening.

Possible Reasons Things Happen

Sinful acts by others or myself

Well intentioned acts (mine or others) that go wrong (Murphey’s Law)

Things break or wear out in our fallen world

Chance that seems random, but may or may not be

Others responding to what I’ve said or done (reaping what I’ve sowed)

Physical consequences of my actions

Several or many different things happening at once

How this works in real life

 If someone you know and love kills themselves and a friend attempts to comfort you by saying, “Everything happens for a reason,” what do they mean? Do they mean that depression resulted in this person killing themselves?

Almost certainly no. When people say this they are referring to some vague and unknown universal power or deity or just “the universe” itself has some sort of plan or purpose and your friends suicide somehow, in some unknown and unknowable way, fits into this mysterious plan.

This is what is so objectionable from a Biblical perspective.  First of all God is not unknowable and secondly who are you to say that everything is part of his plan? What about our free will and our responsibility for what we choose to say and do?

According to the Bible everything that happens is NOT what God wants to happen, and He does NOT make it happen. He allows it to happen, but that’s completely different from causing or approving it. That’s why many things are labeled sin by God, they happen alright but not because they are part of God’s plan or He wants them too.

33  “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or make the tree bad and its fruit bad, for the tree is known by its fruit. 34  You brood of vipers! How can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35  The good person out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil person out of his evil treasure brings forth evil. 36  I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak, 37  for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.” Matthew 12:33-37 (ESV)

  • We are responsible for what we do, think, feel and say, and we will answer for all those before God. That nine-year-old little boy who was killed in Chicago this weekend was NOT part of God’s plan. The reason he was shot was because of sin. The person or people responsible will be held accountable by God.

1  The word of the LORD came to me: 2  “What do you mean by repeating this proverb concerning the land of Israel, ‘The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children’s teeth are set on edge’? 3  As I live, declares the Lord GOD, this proverb shall no more be used by you in Israel. 4  Behold, all souls are mine; the soul of the father as well as the soul of the son is mine: the soul who sins shall die. 5  “If a man is righteous and does what is just and right— 6  if he does not eat upon the mountains or lift up his eyes to the idols of the house of Israel, does not defile his neighbor’s wife or approach a woman in her time of menstrual impurity, 7  does not oppress anyone, but restores to the debtor his pledge, commits no robbery, gives his bread to the hungry and covers the naked with a garment, 8  does not lend at interest or take any profit, withholds his hand from injustice, executes true justice between man and man, 9  walks in my statutes, and keeps my rules by acting faithfully—he is righteous; he shall surely live, declares the Lord GOD. 10  “If he fathers a son who is violent, a shedder of blood, who does any of these things 11  (though he himself did none of these things), who even eats upon the mountains, defiles his neighbor’s wife, 12  oppresses the poor and needy, commits robbery, does not restore the pledge, lifts up his eyes to the idols, commits abomination, 13  lends at interest, and takes profit; shall he then live? He shall not live. He has done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood shall be upon himself. Ezekiel 18:1-13 (ESV)

  • God does have a plan, but it’s based on FREE WILL. Therefore everything that happens isn’t part of His plan. Yes He knows it will happen and yes He has a way to accomplish His will in spite of those events, but they are still NOT happening for some mystical reason. They are the result of sin, and that’s the bottom line on that!

46  “If they sin against you—for there is no one who does not sin—and you are angry with them and give them to an enemy, so that they are carried away captive to the land of the enemy, far off or near, 47  yet if they turn their heart in the land to which they have been carried captive, and repent and plead with you in the land of their captors, saying, ‘We have sinned and have acted perversely and wickedly,’ 48  if they repent with all their mind and with all their heart in the land of their enemies, who carried them captive, and pray to you toward their land, which you gave to their fathers, the city that you have chosen, and the house that I have built for your name, 49  then hear in heaven your dwelling place their prayer and their plea, and maintain their cause 50  and forgive your people who have sinned against you, and all their transgressions that they have committed against you, and grant them compassion in the sight of those who carried them captive, that they may have compassion on them 1 Kings 8:46-50 (ESV)

 

  • What really offends me about this is just how self righteous it is. I head someone on TV say a while back that they are “a firm believer that everything happens for a reason.” Oh my, how spiritual you think you are! But are you?

 

1  But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. 2  For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3  heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, 4  treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5  having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power. Avoid such people. 2 Timothy 3:1-5 (ESV)

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Episode 168

Disciple Up # 168

Dumb Things Christians Say, Pt. 1

God Won’t Give Me Any More Than I Can Handle

By Louie Marsh, 7-15-2020

 

Intro.

 

First Stupid Saying…God won’t give me more than I can handle

 

The Twisted Scripture Behind This Dumb Saying:

 

11  Now these things happened to them as an example, but they were written down for our instruction, on whom the end of the ages has come. 12  Therefore let anyone who thinks that he stands take heed lest he fall. 13  No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but with the temptation he will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it. 1 Corinthians 10:11-13 (ESV)

 

Notes about this passage:

 

1) Paul is talking about RESISTING TEMPTATION – NOT life in general.

 

2) Paul is WARNING US that if we’re not careful we, like the people in the Old Testament, WILL fall.

 

3) Paul is telling us that God will provide a WAY OF ESCAPE from any and all TEMPTATION not any and all problems.

 

  • A way of escape means WE MUST FIND IT & TAKE IT!
  • This is specifically spoken about temptations NOT suffering in general. Sometimes there is NO escape from that – as Jesus proved conclusively on the cross.

 

Verses Prove the Opposite of this Dumb Saying:

 

8  For we do not want you to be unaware, brothers, of the affliction we experienced in Asia. For we were so utterly burdened beyond our strength that we despaired of life itself. 9  Indeed, we felt that we had received the sentence of death. But that was to make us rely not on ourselves but on God who raises the dead. 10  He delivered us from such a deadly peril, and he will deliver us. On him we have set our hope that he will deliver us again. 11  You also must help us by prayer, so that many will give thanks on our behalf for the blessing granted us through the prayers of many. 2 Corinthians 1:8-11 (ESV)

 

7  But we have this treasure in jars of clay, to show that the surpassing power belongs to God and not to us. 8  We are afflicted in every way, but not crushed; perplexed, but not driven to despair; 9  persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed; 10  always carrying in the body the death of Jesus, so that the life of Jesus may also be manifested in our bodies. 11  For we who live are always being given over to death for Jesus’ sake, so that the life of Jesus also may be manifested in our mortal flesh. 12  So death is at work in us, but life in you. 2 Corinthians 4:7-12 (ESV)

 

13  But I, O LORD, cry to you; in the morning my prayer comes before you. 14  O LORD, why do you cast my soul away? Why do you hide your face from me? 15  Afflicted and close to death from my youth up, I suffer your terrors; I am helpless. 16  Your wrath has swept over me; your dreadful assaults destroy me. 17  They surround me like a flood all day long; they close in on me together. 18  You have caused my beloved and my friend to shun me; my companions have become darkness. Psalm 88:13-18 (ESV)

 

Ministry and the Christian Life are SUPPOSED to be done BEYOND OUR LIMITS!

 

24  Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church, 25  of which I became a minister according to the stewardship from God that was given to me for you, to make the word of God fully known, 26  the mystery hidden for ages and generations but now revealed to his saints. 27  To them God chose to make known how great among the Gentiles are the riches of the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. 28  Him we proclaim, warning everyone and teaching everyone with all wisdom, that we may present everyone mature in Christ. 29  For this I toil, struggling with all his energy that he powerfully works within me. Colossians 1:24-29 (ESV)

 

Where Does This Dumb Saying Come From?

 

It’s from our cultural obsession with SELF!

 

The selfism of our culture has been absorbed into the church so we look for verses that can echo that obsession. This one assures us that God is just waiting around to make things easy on us, to make sure we aren’t over stressed.

 

But the exact opposite is true! God is NOT a lawnmower parent!!

 

1  “I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. 2  Every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away, and every branch that does bear fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3  Already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. 4  Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me. 5  I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. John 15:1-5 (ESV)

 

What Happens If You Believe This?

 

Many do believe it and find comfort in it. However there are some very serious downsides to buying into this baloney.

 

1) You are trusting in a false understanding of Scripture which will crumble and fall out from under you, probably at the worst possible time.

 

2) You put false and impossible expectations upon God, and that leads into an unhealthy relationship with Him.

 

3) You can have your faith severely damaged or destroyed when He doesn’t do what you think He’s supposed to do.

 

4) It keeps you from really deepening your faith, expressing all the gifts God has given you and discovering what God wants your life to be about. Living a life of self-reliance robs you of experience the joy unspeakable that living a life relying upon God and God alone brings you.

Please Get In Touch!

Email – louie@discipleup.org

 


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